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Message-ID: <CAG7+5M3rN-NzC5Mf-ox=W8Dror-cCJD4LhG61RtMV9xgpakFdw@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 15 Apr 2013 14:44:53 -0700
From: Eric Northup <digitaleric@...gle.com>
To: Kees Cook <keescook@...omium.org>
Cc: "H. Peter Anvin" <hpa@...or.com>, Yinghai Lu <yinghai@...nel.org>,
Linux Kernel Mailing List <linux-kernel@...r.kernel.org>,
"kernel-hardening@...ts.openwall.com" <kernel-hardening@...ts.openwall.com>, Thomas Gleixner <tglx@...utronix.de>,
Ingo Molnar <mingo@...hat.com>, "the arch/x86 maintainers" <x86@...nel.org>,
Jarkko Sakkinen <jarkko.sakkinen@...el.com>, Matthew Garrett <mjg@...hat.com>,
Matt Fleming <matt.fleming@...el.com>, Dan Rosenberg <drosenberg@...curity.com>,
Julien Tinnes <jln@...gle.com>, Will Drewry <wad@...omium.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH 6/6] x86: kaslr: relocate base offset at boot
W/the relocation information, we can pick the virtual address to load
at independent from the physical load address.
On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 2:41 PM, Kees Cook <keescook@...omium.org> wrote:
> On Mon, Apr 15, 2013 at 2:25 PM, H. Peter Anvin <hpa@...or.com> wrote:
>> On 04/15/2013 02:06 PM, Eric Northup wrote:
>>> On Sat, Apr 13, 2013 at 8:06 PM, H. Peter Anvin <hpa@...or.com> wrote:
>>>> On 04/13/2013 05:37 PM, Yinghai Lu wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> so decompress code position is changed?
>>>>>
>>>>> You may push out bss and other data area of run-time kernel of limit
>>>>> that boot loader
>>>>> chose according to setup_header.init_size.
>>>>> aka that make those area overlap with ram hole or other area like
>>>>> boot command line or initrd....
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Is there a strong reason to randomize the physical address on 64 bits
>>>> (and if so, shouldn't we do it right?)
>>>
>>> The reason to randomize the physical address is because of the kernel
>>> direct mapping range -- a predictable-to-attackers physical address
>>> implies a predictable-to-attackers virtual address.
>>>
>>> It had seemed to me like changing the virtual base of the direct
>>> mapping would be much more involved than physically relocating the
>>> kernel, but better suggestions would be most welcome :-)
>>>
>>
>> You seem to be missing something here...
>>
>> There are *two* mappings in 64-bit mode. Physically, if you're going to
>> randomize you might as well randomize over the entire range... except
>> not too far down (on either 32 or 64 bit mode)... in particular, you
>> don't want to drop below 16 MiB if you can avoid it.
>>
>> On 64 bits, there is no reason the virtual address has to be randomized
>> the same way.
>
> Aren't we bound by the negative 2GB addressing due to -mcmodel=kernel?
>
> -Kees
>
> --
> Kees Cook
> Chrome OS Security
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